After further consideration i think malika may be right in suggesting that this thread might be more suitable for the Fluff sub-forum and i may sooner or later have to divide it into separate threads for the various factions/races once i have a better grasp of thier relationship to other and begin writing the full faction/race rules.
A summary and gallery of sketches will return to Concept Design soon.
I'm kind of stuck trying to devide the races into more manageable factions or groupings
I was thinking of four main groups.
'the forces of order' - The good races, though i hesitate to use the word good. They all have thier flaws, the elves are proud to the point of hubris, dwarfs are greedy and xenophobic but generally speaking they stand for the advancement of civization and/or the salvation of the world). it contains the classic 'good' fantasy race archetypes, Elves (and faries), Dwarfs (and Gnomes), civilized men etc.
'the forces of chaos' - The evil races, these guys really are villians. Demons and undead overlords and thier human, dwarf, elf, undead and demonic minions. They all owe alliegienge to the malign gods of the Dark Pyre. They stand for the fall of the old ways and a coming time of madness and death. it also contains the Cthonic monsters, mutant beasts such as the chimera and manticore created by diabolic magicks during the first demon war
''the wild folk' - The neutral races, includes the various types of orc, troll, beastmen and sentient monsters such as giants. it also contains humans in the form of bandits, mercenaries and pirates. most have been bribed or threatened into fighting for the dark pyre but some are still willing to fight for the forces of order
'creatures' - non sentient animals and monsters such as rats, spiders, gorgons etc.
with the exception of 'creatures' i was going to concetrate on 4-5 races/factions per group. i can think of loads of other interesting bits and pieces for each group and i'll keep all the things like bird men etc. on the big concept list in the first post.
To add further detail regarding my last post, I think the factions I initially concentrate on for each group will be as follows
Forces of Order; Civilized Men, Barbarians, Dwarfs, Faekin
I've previously refered to these guys as men of the west though the more i think about it the less i want to define them by geography. as i've mentioned previously they are giong to be based on late medieval/earlt renaisance europe with an anachronistic blend of knights, 'da vinci-punk' technology and magic users.
they are probably the closest in mindset and culture to modern real world humans and therefore easier to understand for the uninitiated new gamer. they are the 'introductory' race.
as a whole they can do a bit of everything. good wizards (though not as good as the fae), good craftsmen (though not as good as the low folk) etc. they also support refugee colonies of fae and low folk and barbarian immigrants making them a good introduction to the other factions in the group.
their teeming cosmopolitan cities are conceptually opposed to the demon metropolis of the Dark Pyre
Humans display the psychological flaws of all of the older races (meaning they are, as a whole, proud, arrogant, greedy and xenophobic) though not to the same extremes
These are the Elves and Fairies.
Faeries are diminutive but potent magic users and shape shifters. they are rare and physically very weak and fragile but amongst the most powerful wizards in the forces of order. they were created at the dawn of the world and are also one of the oldest races.
Elves are descended from faeries. They are proud and arrogant. There are three main races in the faction. Faeries, Bright Elves and Sylvan Elves though there are other sub-species such as high elves and grey elves.
generally speaking they are fast and accurate (both in combat and at range), even non wizard Fae can have access to limited magic. however they are easy to injure and lack strength in close combat.
They reproduce slowly taking up to a centruy to reach maturity meaning that they are dying out from attrition.
The Low Folk
These are the Gnomes and Dwarfs
Gnomes are related to faeries, created at roughly the same time. they dig and burrow and live under ground. Gnomes are renowned craftsmen and enchanters. small and bearded with a deceptive strength.
Dwarfs are decended from Gnomes in much the same way as Elves are from Faeries. They are slow but hard hitting and dextrous. they are also of a dour, stubborn mindset.
they a known for thier greed and distrust for other races. Like the other elder races they are slow to reproduce. They are generally good craftsmen and wariors but lack much magical skill except for enchantment and alchemy
I need to think of a better name for these guys. they are proud and noble nomadic hunters that follow the herds trought the plains and forsets. In they have fought guerilla wars against other factions for centuries and are skilled in the ways of combat.
they are tougher and more resilient than most other races of men but rarely use armour and wield primative magic (not nesecarrilly less potent, just more in tune with nature) The tend to be more independtly minded than other humans.
they will be inspired by a mix of european barbarians and native american plains tribes. they are unmatched horsemen. the common character types are along the lines of berserkers, scouts/rangers and shamans/witch doctors.
in the past they have raided neibouring lands and are constantly wary of attacks from the wild folk during thier travel
Forces of Chaos;Hell Knights, Demons, Black Elves, Evil Dwarfs, Revenants
This kind of reads like trying to cram in every fantasy creature and race ever, is this too much?
Skimming the surface here and basically replicating a generic fantasy setting. Should the focus not be on two-four races/factions max to actually do them them justice, and actually produce something of substance.
Can it be shaken up, a dwarf is still a Tolkien dwarf here.
What about making them one with nature, building in stone and cultivating the land. Instead of being greedy making them wise and caring, like the old grandfather archetype.
Make elves live under mountains or something and abhor nature, they like gems and jewels and live in bright cold ice palaces. They become invisible in sunlight/sunlight is like oxygen to them and they die in darkness.
Make demons reside on the moon and only manifest on earth in darkness, or a few days a month on the full moon. Sunlight burns them.
Make Dark Pyre a piece of a moon or an asteroid that fell, cracked the earth and caused the dark magma land, demons came out the rock and created the dark kingdom.
Instead of making humans the young race, what about making them just as ancient as everyone else. Or the result of dwarf elf mating to create men: the dwarfs and elves are jealous parents who want to meddle in human affairs. Dwarfs the masculine, elves the feminine.
There's some interesting ideas there Ice. I have been considering the age of humanity compared to the old races. I've even considered like you mention having humans as a hybrid of dwarf and elf but at the moment i'm leaning towards faeries and gnomes being the purest forms of fae and low folk with elfs and dwarfs being human hybrids of a sort. i refer to them as the old races as that was Ed's original idea. i see it as being the civilizations that are older. men have been around as long as the others but for a long time never reached past the tribal stage. thier culture is young, the tribes united and the first small kingdoms and empires formed at about the same time as the first demon war and was influenced greatly by the alliiences they made with the long established civilizations of the gnomes and elves
I want to try and go with some folkloric elements in the old races. if you wanted to compare the old races to tolkien then there are similarities. tolkiens ideas of these races have heavilly influenced thier attributes and appearence in pop culture and have become memes of a sort. in a nod to sciror and to represent the psionic manifestation that brought about the whole dark pyre scenario i wan't the references to reflect those memes. those concepts planted in the collective imagination. that's not a cop out or excuse to just copy what's gone before. I'm just using this thread to ponder how to devide the various races i'd like to include into unique and complementry factions, get peoples opinions and explain some of my reasoning
some things are there to give other people an excuse to include some of the concepts they'd like to work on, for examples kytes asian inspired ape/primate men
I'm going to butcer the first slab of this topic into easier to manage chunks, close this thread and then open some more focussed ones about the factions that we can use to explore interesting twists on the various fantsy archetypes. I'll probably pick one from each group to begin with. given the low number of models needed for the game each race only needs a couple of heroes and maybe half a dozen follower or minion models so coming up with concepts shouldn't be too long a project. once the factions have basic models in place they can always be expanded upon later.
once the first three are out the way i'll move on.
in the mean time i'll continue to think out loud here
Post by daemonslave on Aug 21, 2010 11:13:27 GMT -5
Elementally my dear Watson
Here's a couple of quick doodles for some Elementals - I'm actually gonna have a go at sculpting the Earth elemental (though considering how pants I am anyway at sculpting and that I'm trying out super sculpey firm for the first time as well, then I don't hold much hope of it being very good at all).
Anyway, my doodles (sorry about how bad they look - I haven't got a scanner at the moment and taking photos of pictures never seems to work very well [plus I'm not exactly Da Vinci either]);
Water Elemental (surprisingly hard to think of an original design for this guy - sorry about the cheesy head, I didn't know where else to put it)
Air Elemental (I definately didn't want him to be a cloud like most designs, I tried to get a feeling of airy movement but it looks a bit too wraith-like for my tastes)
Fire Elemental (Most scuplts that I have seen are of a flaming rock man - so I thought lets make him entirely out of fire!)
Earth Elemental (I wanted to capture a slow but brutal monster)
Whilst these are only quick doodles, I hope they give a bit of inspiration (or at least a few chuckles at how bad they are).
I was thinking of less obviously anthropomorhic elementals but i'll take your designs into consideration. Elementals are neutral summoned units and fluff wise i see them being quite similar to the concept of genies. you can summon them to ask for aid but there may be an often unforseen cost or consequence